what was the seismic shift in thinking that rutherford required when he created the great multitude in 1935?
when did the great multitude, or the great crowd as it is now known, become jehovahs witnesses?.
http://www.jwstudies.com/the_great_crowd_before_1935_and_since.pdf.
Hi Phizzy,
To me, these quotations from The Watchtower magazines show them making things up on the run - thought bubbles. It is a pattern that continues to this day, where one thought bubble creates an unintended consequence that has to be patched up, all under the guise of "added light".
Do you have any suggestions where I might go next? As you would gather, I am not interested simply repeating what others have already thoroughly worked on.
Doug
what was the seismic shift in thinking that rutherford required when he created the great multitude in 1935?
when did the great multitude, or the great crowd as it is now known, become jehovahs witnesses?.
http://www.jwstudies.com/the_great_crowd_before_1935_and_since.pdf.
What was the seismic shift in thinking that Rutherford required when he created the “great multitude” in 1935? When did the “great multitude”, or the “great crowd” as it is now known, become “Jehovah’s witnesses”?
http://www.jwstudies.com/The_Great_Crowd_before_1935_and_since.pdf
Doug
sorry if this has been covered, i am not able to access the search function since the new site version.. the topic:when did jws start observing instead of partaking?.
i'm embarrassed to admit i don't know this.. i would guess in the early 30's when the little flock/great crowd/we're jw's doctrines were implemented.. please include references to the publications in your answers!.
( did that sound like a desperate plea for comments on the service meeting?
kairos,
Please excuse me for being a little pedantic.
The anointed were given the name "Jehovah's witnesses" in 1931. As the "anointed" they had been required to partake of the bread and fermented red wine for a long time.
The "great multitude" as is now understood did not exist until 1935. They were not called "Jehovah's witnesses", as that title was limited to the "anointed". From my research, I believe that the "great multitude" were assigned the name "Jehovah's witnesses" in 1948.
I am in the final throes of working on a Study which you might find relevant. I normally release my Studies at the Biblical research part of this site, but in this instance I will also publicise it at this "friends" section.
Send me a pm if you wish.
Doug
from so many posts and conversations on here, you'd think over 1/2 the posters here possess doctorates in theology, physics, biology, etc.
i'm curious aside from the books and research people have done here, what degrees they have.
to start, i just got an aa and going straight through full time to an mba.
Graduate of the University of Hard Knocks, Faculty of Life. The course is still running and has lasted for 74 years so far.
Doug
there was a recent post stating to the effect that fds was simply a parable.. i always remember the debates held with christian students, about whether something was a parable or an illustration.. another thread has that issue.. regardless of whether the word parable or illustration can be applied to the fds, i have a question.. both the aid and insight books have a lengthy article on illustrations.. the article lists 30 of jesus' prominent illustrations.. however, the fds is not one of the 30 (same in aid book).. why not?.
I prepared a serious Study on the subject in 2007, before the GB took over the FDS to itself. Nevertheless, the principles regarding the interpretation of parables and related matters still stands:
http://www.jwstudies.com/FDS_and_its_GB.pdf
Doug
sorry if this has been covered, i am not able to access the search function since the new site version.. the topic:when did jws start observing instead of partaking?.
i'm embarrassed to admit i don't know this.. i would guess in the early 30's when the little flock/great crowd/we're jw's doctrines were implemented.. please include references to the publications in your answers!.
( did that sound like a desperate plea for comments on the service meeting?
“On November 15, 1934, the book Jehovah … on page 182 still expressed belief in a secondary spiritual class, yet expected to come out of Babylon the Great. … Thus this secondary class of spirit-begotten spiritual Israelites was still diverting the attention of the remnant late in 1934 and was taking a place of greater importance than the Jonadabs or earthly ‘other sheep’ class, who were to be marked in their foreheads. (Ezek. 9:4) So these marked ones were not specifically invited to attend the celebration of the Lord’s Supper on Nisan 14, 1935.” (The Watchtower announcing Jehovah’s Kingdom, February 15, 1966, pages 119-120)
“In the congregations of Jehovah’s people larger privileges of service were opened to the members of the Jonadab class or “great multitude” when the Watchtower issue of May 1, 1937, page 130, announced concerning the companies or congregations: “… Let the Jonadabs be placed on the service committee and give them opportunity to serve.” … At the celebration of the Lord’s Supper following the above announcement … the Jonadabs were specifically invited to attend as companions of the remnant on April 15, 1938. – The Watchtower, February 15, 1938, page 50” (The Watchtower announcing Jehovah’s Kingdom, February 15, 1966, page 121)
Doug
there was a recent post stating to the effect that fds was simply a parable.. i always remember the debates held with christian students, about whether something was a parable or an illustration.. another thread has that issue.. regardless of whether the word parable or illustration can be applied to the fds, i have a question.. both the aid and insight books have a lengthy article on illustrations.. the article lists 30 of jesus' prominent illustrations.. however, the fds is not one of the 30 (same in aid book).. why not?.
The GB knows that the parable is about them because the parable is about them.
Doug
a while ago i posted on another thread that i had been told by some witnesses that the tetragrammaton had been in the original christian greek scriptures but had been removed when apostacy came into the church .
i did not know where this came from at the time .however while looking something else up i came across this .as i could not find the original thread i have started a new one .here is a quote from nwt reference edition 1984 :-.
" matthew made more than a hundred quotations from the inspired hebrew scriptures.
BluesBrother,
Note that the article correctly differentiates between the "Hebrew Scriptures" and the "Greek translations of the Hebrew Scriptures". The latter is known generically as the Septuagint (LXX).
We do not know what the "Hebrew Scriptures" contained in Jesus' time because the earliest Hebrew text comes from the early Middle Ages, about 1000 years after Jesus' time. This happened because the Masoretic Jews decided there would be only one version. The Jews has long rejected the "Greek translations", mostly because the arguments that the Christians had drawn from those versions.
There were various versions of the Greek (Septuagint) translations and the NT writers drew from all of them, including some we no longer have access to.
The evidence from the Dead Sea Community shows that only their Isaiah scroll agrees with our current versions. Other scrolls (Habbakuk, etc., etc.) disagree with our texts. And the fragments that contain the Divine Name employ ancient Hebrew characters that were no longer in use; so these Hebrew characters appeared within Greek writing - hardly evidence that they had any contemporary meaning.
To make sweeping statements based on a few fragments is to indulge in the false reasoning of "from the individual to the whole". The typical example of this is: "I saw a dog with three legs, therefore all dogs have three legs".
Besides, the WTS does not use the Divine Name, whether in ancient Hebrew characters or modern. To say that such characters would be meaningless to a modern reader highlights how meaningless the apperance of the characters were to Greek readers. Perhaps the WTS could overcome this with HWHY. Yes, the Hebrew characters read from right to left whereas the Greek writing runs from left to right.
The WTS would be considered to be genuine if it only used the HWHY whenever a NT writer was directly quoting a Hebrew text that contained the Name. However, the WTS does nothing of the sort, sprinking "Jehovah" at places where it suits their predetermined outcomes.
Doug
a while ago i posted on another thread that i had been told by some witnesses that the tetragrammaton had been in the original christian greek scriptures but had been removed when apostacy came into the church .
i did not know where this came from at the time .however while looking something else up i came across this .as i could not find the original thread i have started a new one .here is a quote from nwt reference edition 1984 :-.
" matthew made more than a hundred quotations from the inspired hebrew scriptures.
I have made Professor George Howard's recent handwritten available letter at:
http://www.jwstudies.com/Reply_to_M_P_by_Professor_Howard.pdf
I apologise for the quality but that is beyond my control.
Doug
a while ago i posted on another thread that i had been told by some witnesses that the tetragrammaton had been in the original christian greek scriptures but had been removed when apostacy came into the church .
i did not know where this came from at the time .however while looking something else up i came across this .as i could not find the original thread i have started a new one .here is a quote from nwt reference edition 1984 :-.
" matthew made more than a hundred quotations from the inspired hebrew scriptures.
There were several versions of the Greek Septuagint. The texts located at the Dead Sea shows great variations. apart from the Isaiah scroll.
In its NT, the WTS does not limits its use of "Jehovah" (not the Tetragram) to places where the OT might have used the Tetragram. In places where the Greek text does include it, we see ancient Hebrew characters in a Greek text. These characters were so ancient at the time of the DSS community, that they were no longer in use.
I have a copy of a recent letter from Professor Howard in which he once again complains of the WTS's misuse of his work. He, of course, limited his work on Matthew's gospel, based on a middle age Hebrew text which used "H" to represent "Hashem" - The Name.
Doug
